developping a PRETTY nice interface for … Ableton Live.
it talks about:
- removing the screen
- eat your mouse
- only use your fingers and intuition
- forget your cables
wow… I told too much.
so I have to say:
I’m working actually on a nice project which could be finished quiet soon.
It is a secret.
But I can write here it will be fantastic, user-friendly, beautiful, amazing, reliable!
very soon, we’ll open a newsletter to inform about the last steps before the release.
Du 22 au 26 novembre à Marseille, je dispense une formation sur l’environnement max/MSP/jitter.
Le contenu sera celui-ci
Il est aussi possible d’ajouter des éléments sur demande.
Des prix promotionnels vont être annoncés cette semaine.
ATTENTION: le nombre de place est limité à 7 personnes.
L’objectif est de bien prendre le temps avec chacun et 7 est un bon chiffre pour cela.
n’hésitez pas à écrire à julien@designthemedia.com pour pré-réservez
en espérant vous rencontrer à cette occasion …
Julien
It will talk about the making of the protodeck but not only technically speaking.
I want to talk about:
- experiences about Live and why simplification doesn’t mean to reduce features but to power your framework
- why I didn’t buy a ready-to-use controller
- why the use of mouse + keyboard only is very bad
- why I use rgb leds + buttons instead of beautiful rubby gum buttons
- to know how many buttons you want is more important than how you’d wire them
- thinking more about “timing stuff” & “filtering objects” than filter,delay,reverb,resonator etc, can make you more intuitive than before
etc
I enjoyed to prepare that, and I guess I’ll enjoy to provide it.
It would be a 2hours session.
I hope you’ll be numerous here or there!
I’d love to make a protodeck with all in my hands in one day in front of interested people.
It could be done in marseille.
I’m designing a new controller, it isnt a big secret.
I’d probably have parts and I’d LOVE to have you here, with me, learning to solder, to upload codes and to leave for home with your controller under the arm !!!
Peter, as his associates, is very nice.
Let’s read this nice interview together.
Precise, smart and clear answers give us a lot of information about this precious and powerful company named Livid Instruments
Julien : Who is Livid Instruments? Peter : Livid was founded by three partners: Jay Smith, Travis Redding, and myself, Peter Nyboer. Jay was the hub in getting us working together as he took advantage of my programming and Travis’s building for his Viditar controller. We eventually all became partners in Livid as a real business. Primarily, I deal with software, Travis deals with manufacture, and Jay deals with business matters, design, and marketing. We all work together on design and communications.
Julien : What are you making exactly, hardware or software ? Peter : We make both. Our primary products are hardware products, and we have a number of applications to make them more useful and more fun. We also sell a video mixing program called “CellDNA” which is a really easy to use, but still very powerful, realtime video mixer with OpenGL effects.
Julien : How do you proceed to design hardware ? Do you ask to users directly through the precious users forums on your website or do you only observe tendencies to build the state-of-art yours ? Peter : We initially started by offering a hardware+software video package, designed as an all in one VJ product (the “Tactic”) that essentially used the computer as a video mixing engine, but provided a full hardware interface so VJs wouldn’t have to be dependent on the mouse and keyboard. A lot of that design was influenced by what we could get from the computers at the time, as well as providing a reasonably-sized hardware.
Branching from that, we now provide MIDI hardware that can be used for a variety of software, whether it’s audio, video, or lighting. A lot of what we do comes from our initial work with the Tactic, but made more generic and with more control. We try to consider different scenarios and softwares, and adapt the hardware as needed, mostly letting electronic music guide us. For example, on the Ohm64, the left side has 12 knobs, which comes from a general need for 3 rows of EQ. But they are obviously very useful for other things! The 8×8 grid of buttons spawns from our original 6×6 grid, but, again, music likes the number “8,” so we we expanded it.
As we continue making hardware, we now have more users who are willing to offer up worthwhile ideas, and we hope to work more of those into future products. We also have ideas about the nature of control and gesture in music making that will become more of an influence in our designs.
Julien : Will we have to change the firmware to use with this or that DAW or is it more user-friendly and with the same hardware we only have to to load this or that piece of code on the computer side ? Peter : It depends on the software and the way the user has their setup. We have auto-mapping templates for Reason, Live, Tracktor, and a variety of lighting softwares and VJ software (including our own CellDNA) will automatically map to our hardware. Some people reprogram the MIDI output with our Editor application so the controller fits in with their unique setups or other hardware better.
Julien : I saw you cooked pieces of software for reaktor, for ableton live. Why wouldn’t you directly work with them to build their controller ? I mean, would you prefer to stay more general, more universal instead of become specialized on this or that DAW ? Peter : Those companies have their own things going! We do have some OEM jobs going for some smaller companies, but the larger ones are already cranking out their controllers.
Besides that, the business of making a controller specific to a piece of software, I think, limits the creative possibilities. It’s great for getting up and running, but when a button is labeled “play”, it either enforces a way of working, or distracts you. We want it to be easy for someone to work in Max/MSP, or control a synth in Reason, or DJ a set in Live, or even control lighting. I think a lot of people are becoming more sophisticated and flexible with digital media so they won’t necessarily be tied to a single piece of software or even a type of output. We want to make controllers that speak to that creative growth and flexibility, and don’t need to be replaced every 2 years.
Julien : Why did you choose to kiss opensource world by creating a DIY part of your activity ? Peter : Part of it is that a lot of people have ideas for controllers that suit their own way of working, and come to us and say “you should build this!” Other people know their ideas are far-out and not part of a “market” but they want things for their own work. Well, we have limited resources, and can only put out so many products, but that doesn’t mean that person should not have what they want! So we provide the tools for them to build it. We also got started in this business by doing things ourselves, and so it’s natural that we want that to continue, and we are really happy we can be a part of it.
It also helps us in experimenting with ideas ourselves, and helps us keep costs down by being able to buy parts in larger quantities than if we only sold controllers.
Julien : What do you think about proprietary vs opensource software ? Peter : Well, we dabble in both, and they both have their advantages. Open source is a nice way to make your ideas accessible, and get material feedback on how your ideas grow. However, our open source softwares (Looper, OhmSound, LividStep, our Editors) are really only partially open, as they are built in Max/MSP, a proprietary environment. We will also likely be opening the source of the firmware of our soon-to-be-released Code hardware, and that should be exciting.
We have considered open sourcing CellDNA, but, given that I’d have to prepare a lot of commenting and organization for the source to be really useful, we haven’t bothered. It would also likely be harder to sell if it were open source! We have made it “open-minded” in that it’s extensible with Max/MSP patches, and all the Effects and Extras that come with the software are readily accessible and changeable by users.
Julien : How do you see the future of hardware ? Only multitouch screen or still knobs and pots ? Peter : Unless people’s sense of touch goes the way of our sense of smell, we are always going to need something to hold, feel, and fetishize. We are all about trying to make that feeling more like the instruments of the past, where your senses are engaged by the look, the feel, and a personal bond with the interface between you and your art.
Multitouch may someday be augmented with haptic feedback, providing the flexibility of multitouch with the sensory advantage of mechanical devices, but that is pure science fiction right now.
Julien : What does it make Livid Instruments very different from others ? Peter : We are a domestic, smaller scale manufacturer of hardware controllers. We use high quality components to respect the musician’s tactile needs. We try to produce as much domestically as possible. If you want a custom controller, or some custom changes or looks to your controller, we can do that do. We respect style and individuality. When you email or call us, it’s the people who make the stuff you are talking to. In other words, we are VERY different from most of the other players in this game!
With the iPad release and the huge number of possibilities with it, surfing the web & read book, but more as a multitouch/big screen hardware, came Griid.
Griid is an iphone OS application that provides clips matrix control for Ableton Live.
It uses Ableton Live Control Surfaces scripts (of course) to connect to Ableton Live through the Grid connector (it is described here)
So it could be a nice add-on, if it was a little bit more open and not only business made-for…
It is a bit annoying to see it is available only for MAC OSX.
Probably to close tighter the stuff.
Developping interface for Ableton Live is very easy (if you know how to do that, of course)
I mean, Ableton provided a FULL official API to do that… controlling parameters, read the clip matrix, interact with clips even notes through max for live.
Griid can be understood as a complete package for people who doesn’t want to build anything else than music (and spend money for that without doing anything)
It is very respectable.
But (the famous but… there is always one But or even more) really… it is done to constraint more the system, the interface design etc.
You buy it, you use it. You want more, you can’t customize it.
If they wanted an open system, of course, they wouldn’t have chosen only OSX, but provided another kind of API with their system. nothing like that. only hardcoded stuff.
Even if I could be happy to see new interfaces, I’m not completely with griid.
If I wanted to put a little kidding here, I would say:
I’ll provide a FREE stuff for you iphone, using OSC.
Because the system I made and available through the protodeck page is a real strong but opensource system. Made with JS, useable with the protodeck, and with ALL system that could speak MIDI, OSC or even other language over the wire!
Some people would write: Julien is jealous or even he’s stupid because he didn’t sell the protodeck.
Firstly, who said I didn’t sell it?
Secondly, if I was jealous I’d try to make a griid killer.
Thirdly, never believe people talking about me, THEY are jealous
So to answer the question, this app + device is a nice interface.
For my opinion, interface SHOULD BE provided with API.
It is the proper sense of an interface.
Especially in our domains, art & technology.
We NEED to customize, even just a little bit.
We NEED to feel that we can build over what we buy
We NEED to give to people real tools, not only buttons.
hello,
un message en français, ça changera un peu les habitudes.
Je prépare des sessions de cours intensifs Ableton Live & max/MSP/Jitter pour le dernier trimestre 2010.
Les informations nécessaires (programmes, tarifs) sont ici : http://designthemedia.com/fr/formations
N’hésitez pas à poser vos questions à l’adresse suivante : julien.bayle@gmail.com
Je peux aussi répondre par chat à la même adresse sur gtalk et msn, et sur julien.bayle avec skype.
Ces sessions se passeront à Marseille, en plein centre ville, dans un lieu magique et innovant, propice à l’apprentissage et stimulant.
Plus d’informations sur demande.
why did I spend a lot of time on software part of the protodeck interface? or even on the firmware part?
because this isn’t only the wiring & hardware which matters! not at all !!!
we often have pretty powerful hardware with limited or ugly code inside.
today, memories are cheaper, cpu are less cheaper but cheaper too.
so this is not the problem.
a nice anecdote.
Google released Android 2.2, the famous OS for smartphone.
Constructors often add their little specific layers in order to make their hardware & software closer.
I can understand that.
BUT, providers do that too.
and I don’t really agree.
Because I’m paying them for my line, I cannot be sure they don’t limit it, or anything else !
I was on HTC Desire with an Android 2.1 Orange-modified ROM.
All was ok. smooth etc.
Yesterday, I rooted it and upgraded it with the REAL Android 2.2 ROM from HTC.
It has added a lot of features… of course FROYO (codename of Android 2.2) is newer
BUT a big thing changed!
(before, just a remark: 3G+ = HPSA ok)
let’s continue: before the upgrade, I was always with the 3G bandwidth.
after the upgrade, I’m everytime with HPSA bandwidth
and indeed, surf is VERY VERY smoother and faster than before!
WOW!
the question to finish: Does Orange limit the bandwidth directly on the endpoints ???
It sucks but Do It Yourself attitude saved me … once again
I’m using KiCAD.
It is a pretty nice and complete software, opensource & free.
You can check it and download it here
The most annoying thing is : finding the right components,ok!
Eagle seems to provide much more libraries. But Eagle is expensive if you plan to make a big PCB (by the way, 100 x 80 mm is quite ok for a lot of us. I needed more, so..)
Component in Kicad or even in Eagle are 2 files:
- the schematics (diagrams with pins, logic only)
- the modules (physical trace with correct sizes)
So there are at least 3 solutions for finding the right components:
- looking for here: http://www.kicadlib.org/ or http://per.launay.free.fr/kicad/kicad_php/composant.php
- making your own (it is the best solution. Not too difficult to make schematics & traces. traces should be done with datasheet in hands)
- using a conversion script inside eagle (called an ulp script) : eagle2kicad-0.9b.ulp
for the last way, you have to open the lib you want to convert in Eagle.
Choose ulp in the toolbar, choose the right script (eagle2kicad-0.9b.ulp) & give the 2 names & paths.
Sometimes, it works, sometimes it doesn’t.
as these files (sch & mod) are all full text, I had sometimes to edit them a bit to make them working fine.
but, let’s say… you want to succeed or not ?! so you have to work a bit
some could ask “why do you use kicad yet because you already did the protodeck?”
I’d answer them.
a LOT of people writes me about the protodeck.
they want their own.
so should I build a kind of protodeck lite or not?
it could be sold with:
- full patch & scripts to make it plug and play with live
- full apps to use it like a pure monome
the strong point would be the apps provided with that, the compactness, the rgb leds and the great amount of knobs and … shhhh.
how could this be profitable to make it possible ?
(the secret message in that means: guys, prepare your liveset, a new controller will be created soon and let me know if you’re interested!)
At the beginning, they were those 2 ARM boards.
I began my first electronic projects with them.
Those 2 boards are very similar.
You can find a little comparative tab here but it isn’t the point here.
Those boards provide:
- a processor (that thinks and calculates)
- a FTDI Chip (that converts everything in USB standard!)
- digital inputs/outputs (to read/write 0v or 5V pulses)
- analog inputs/outputs (to read from 0v to 5V pulses and to mimic analog output by Pulse Width Modulation…a nice process you can learn here)
- a full and user-friendly IDE that gives you a nice text windows to write C/C++ program and all the features to automatically include libraries, to compile the whole stuff and to upload the program directly to the board.
The whole components are soldered, ready to use!
It is a very nice stuff to learn about electronic, coding and more.. to make nice and very powerful projects.
I can provide courses about those parts too. It would be great to add that in the big list about what we could do with my future training center / hackerspace
I hesitated a lot before building the protodeck.
I wanted to use Arduino for that.
Even if I needed A LOT more inputs and outputs, by using the big tricky tip of Shift Registering, I could use them.
However, I decided to use the MIDIBOX framework for another reason.
It was more an open-source community & specialized framework reason.
MIDIBOX is more music interface oriented (by design, and by name too…)
The community evolved a lot in this direction and the whole framework is very achieved and optimized now.
The architecture is easy to understand (it is not my diagram):
There is a bootloader that is only up during 5s. It loads the MIOS. The MIOS executes your application.
- bootloader is like the PC’s BIOS
- MIOS is the Operating System
- application is the part you code
The part that interested me was the MIOS part.
Indeed, this part provided a C Wrapper (wow, man. What is this?!)
It is a “kind of” API that provides you functions you can use in your application instead of coding directly assembly (that is efficient but a pain in the … foot!)
The MIOS part was already very mature too.
So I only had to focus on my application.
This is what I did. And I succeeded (yeah!)
Design the Media vient de publier sa première vidéo d’explication globale des services proposées.
On y parle de technologies, de musique, mais aussi d’électronique et d’ateliers.
Rien ne peut être dévoilé encore, mais rapidement, une newsletter va sortir.
Elle aura pour numéro zéro.
On y trouvera un certain nombre d’information et l’invitation à participer à un sondage qui sera je l’espère rempli par un maximum d’entre vous.
Do it Yourself signifie aussi, impliquons nous dans nos passions.
Faites vous même ce que vous n’avez pas envie d’attendre des autres.
It could be a pretty nice thing to show the protodeck there ; because they are those that fight for open-source stuff.
we all have to remember: protodeck is FULL open-source!
and more, I made it with FULL open-source software:
- kicad
- GNU midibox toolchain
- GNU C
- mios Operating System
and it is fully described on that page under Creative Commons License!
I’d like to explain the very close love between proprietary & open-source worlds with the nice opened way of max for live.
If they give me a chance to do that, I’ll do my best for that
Opening a big training center / hackerspace would be so fun.
It could provide courses about high-skill & futuristic technology (from ableton live to JAVA, from C# to hardware hacking, from AS3 to Adobe suite) and it could provide great workshops (streamed on the web, realtime, of course), pretty geeky but professional seminars.
I have many freelance high skilled friends that could work with me. All very nice, strong & loving technology & artistic creation !
I’d love to drive a plane like that.
Not on non-profit mode, not on “only profit needed” mode… just running for the happiness of everyone
I began a french survey about that.
I’d like to spread it EVERYWHERE in France, from company sponsorship services to student potential user, from artists to … you !
If kickstarter existed in Europe, I’d run a big project fund raising for that.
Not sure if it could work.
But I’m sure YOU are a lot interested by that.
even if you weren’t in France, but Belgium, Italy, Spain or UK.
We speak english to with our ugly accent!
So if YOU are interested, you can write me an email.
If you think you could be involved in that on any way, write me too.
“on any way” means:
- spread the survey
- spread the message
- send me nice “good luck” message
- talk to your boss for sponsoring that
- find ideas to provide things
- anything else from your brain cause all your ideas will make the stuff!
Some pictures taken at the last evening show in Marseille, at Apero Codelab #8.
Thanks to Magali, Thomas & others !
Thanks to LùLù & Denis &… la mia bestea bien sûr!
